CITY OF BERKELEY LAKE

4040 BERKELEY LAKE ROAD

BERKELEY LAKE, GEORGIA 30096

PUBLIC HEARING/COUNCIL MEETING

Full Minutes

August 15, 2002

Those in attendance for the Public Hearing and Council Meeting were as follows:

Mayor – Lois Salter

Council Members: Frank Lombardi, Delicia Reynolds, and David Steventon, Ken Massaroni

Dick Carothers – City Attorney

Claire Grimes – City Clerk

Tom Kitchens – BLEMA

Citizens Present 41

CALL TO ORDER

Mayor Salter called the meeting to order at 6:10 PM at 4043 South Berkeley Lake Road.

PUBLIC HEARING

Changes to the Gwinnett County Floodplain Ordinance. There were no Citizens Comments about the Floodplain Ordinance.

CITIZENS’ COMMENTS

The following citizens made Comments:

1. Skip Johnson 420 Lakeshore Drive – Skip stated that while attending the last Council meeting in July, he heard disturbing information about a proposed City Center building. Skip stated that he had asked questions and found that the City Center was in the works and the community would not be asked whether or not they were in agreement. He stated that he came tonight to say that he does not agree with it. “ Our community has grown as much as it is going to grow. The fact that we need to expand City Hall is not justification to build the kind of facility for the amount of dollars that are suggested.” Skip further stated that he hopes for a resolution of the issues between the City and the Chapel.

2. Pam Williamson 3996 South Berkeley Lake Road – Pam asked if the new citations had been issued regarding the commercial business that is being run out of 4016 S Berkeley Lake Rd. City Attorney Carothers stated that he had met with the OEO Charlie Sewell and would like to consult with Council during executive session before the citations are issued. “The process will go forward very quickly after tonight.” There is a court date on September 11th but Mr. Carothers stated that he was not certain of the defendant attorney’s schedule.

Pam further stated that during the last court session, there was absolutely no Council Member present and that was very disheartening to her and to the other citizens who were present. “ It showed a sincere lack of support from the City Council to keep our community as a residential community.” She stated that she would like the City Council to support stopping this business, which is a home purchased for the sole purpose of conducting a business which operates in the City. She stated that she would like to see this stopped as soon as possible.

3. Rigsby Barnes 570 Lakeshore Drive – Rigsby asked where he could find more information about the proposed new building. He stated that after going through the Minutes of last months meeting, he discovered that Council was discussing the possibility of using the Chapel as a mixed-use facility. Mr. Barnes stated that he would be in favor of that plan. On the surface the plan to build a City Center does not make a lot of sense and there needs to be more information forthcoming before he could make a decision on this issue.

4. Tom Kitchens 150 Bayway Circle – Tom stated that there are issues relative to the City Center building that citizens may not be aware of and he would like to hear openly all that has been done to move from where we had plans in place to expand the City Hall which is where the City currently conducts business to a new City Center building. “What has Council done to move from an approved plan with support of grant money to modify the existing City Hall to a brand new City Center that will environmentally impact our City? The citizens here tonight would like to hear the details of this transition.” Mr. Kitchens further talked about the silt coming into the lake from the Maltese property through the pipes under the road at 266 Lakeshore. The BLHA is responsible to remove the silt, but it is the City’s responsibility is to stop Pete Maltese from letting the silt enter the lake. Also what is the status with the engineering contractor who was supposed to make recommendations on the huge flow of water running beside Rodney Hammond’s property? Mr. Kitchens shared a photo of the silt entering the lake by Mr. Bondon’s and Mr. Hammond’s property. The Mayor stated that there is a request before the County from Mr. Maltese for a variance in order to build a lot of town homes on his property. The County tabled the first hearing and it has been rescheduled. The Mayor continued by stating that Charlie Sewell along with Mr. Dave Bondon went out on foot to track down the source of the silt entering the lake from the pipe at Mr. Hammond’s house. They discovered that the source was not the Maltese property but a development going on behind Stan Litton’s gas station. Charlie contacted the County and they have put a Stop Work Order on the property until the problem is fixed.

5. Cindy Phelps 4371 South Berkeley Lake Rd. – Cindy stated that in regards to the proposed City Center building, she wanted to remind Council that the Pinkneyville Center is finished and has over five extra rooms for activities. “The Center is only one-half mile from our City and should be utilized.” Cindy stated that she finds it hard to take out more trees and bring in more parking and then have people from outside Berkeley Lake welcomed to come to a municipal building. She agrees that the City needs to extend the current City Hall and that we have spent over five thousand dollars of our tax money to have plans drawn. “Even if we don’t use the exact plan without the pavilion, that money has already been spent and now we have spent over five thousand more to survey something without even asking the citizens. “With a two million dollar building within a half-mile that we can use and having read in the Minutes that other citizens have voiced their concerns, I am very much against moving forward with a City Center.”

6. Ron Phelps 4371 South Berkeley Lake Rd. – Ron stated that he has been hearing the same rumors about a three hundred thousand dollar activity center and he wanted to say that he would initially be against something like that. “If the Council were acting on behalf of the citizens of Berkeley Lake, they would put something like that to a vote. It is not a small project. Expansion of City Hall makes sense and would not have problems getting approved, but the citizens of Berkeley Lake would probably not support a huge activity center.”

7. Debbie Guthrie 4417 Bush Road – Debbie stated that she hopes that the City can bring resolution soon regarding the commercial activities at 4016 South Berkeley Lake Road. Debbie stated that she has not been able to find out much about the proposed City Center building even after searching the website. “ Certainly there has been no information circulated that would answer the types of questions I have. I would like to ask Council to put out more information and then to put this to a citywide vote. The citizens should vote on whether or not they want this.”

8. Nick Lore 50 Lakeshore Drive – Nick stated his concern over not having control over our City’s roads. On any given day when he takes walks with his child he encounters 10 bicycles or several cars or motorcycles traveling around the lake at easily twice the speed limit posted on Lakeshore Drive. “ The bicycles create a sincere hazard on our walkways. This is a real problem.” He asked Council that before they consider building the City Center; he would challenge the Council to consider the welfare of the community and the citizens relative to a safe walk on Lakeshore or South Berkeley. “ The sidewalks really don’t offer us that much of a security blanket as far as what is happening. It would be easy for a car to lose control at the speeds I see daily on S. Berkeley Lake in spite of the stop signs. Cars come down the hill at over 50 and 60 MPH.” He asked if there could ever be any way to stop the Berkeley Lake roadway by putting up a blockade where Bush road comes into the City. “Also is there any way to put speed tables up in certain locations where speeding cars lose control around the curves. In three years I have had four cars lose control and come onto my property and do over six thousand dollars combined damage. Thankfully, no one was walking there when it happened. The other possibility would be card access through the four entranceways in the City. The only other observation is that the Chapel wants to obtain the funds to renovate this building and yet this building sits empty 90% of the time. I wonder if there could be a way that the City could sign some kind of long-term lease for the accommodations of the space at the Chapel and at the same time help us rebuild the Chapel. It seems like a win-win situation.” The Mayor introduced the police liaison Doug McClure stating that he has been made aware of the bicycle situation. She stated that she has asked him to monitor the bicycle traffic and to arrest anyone who is breaking the law. “We have raised the citation rates significantly on all the roads within the City. There were three DUI arrests in the last week.” Council Member Arakawa has been in charge of the speed table investigation and the Mayor urged anyone who was interested to contact him.

9. Joe Voyles 630 Lakeshore Drive - Joe stated that he visits City Hall quite often and he doesn’t understand how business is conducted there. “ They practically sit in each other’s laps and when they want to talk on the phone they have to go in the bathroom in order to hear and they have to turn the light off because the fan makes too much noise. There is no question that something has to be done. It is a real shame that there is a separation of Church and State here in the City because the Chapel facility with not much congregation will not have a large windfall of money any time soon to facilitate the renovations needed. Without a good shot of money to fix some of the vital parts of it, it will become condemnable before long. It is a wonderful space and it is not used 90% of the time. If it does become a public building it would create a problem with the access to the lake. The way the City is growing, we must do something. It is not a matter of IF; it is a matter of WHAT.”

10. George Kaffezakis 490 Lakeshore Drive – George stated that he would like the Council to consider not only the cost of building of a new City Center but also the long-term maintenance costs. “Any time you build a facility there will be maintenance costs afterward. He also asked if Council has considered having a joint City/citizens committee to further investigate the options on how to best identify the needs we are trying to address and also how to address the needs in the most economical and positive manner.”

11. Dana Nigh 4006 South Berkeley Lake Rd. -Dana stated her support for what George said and stated that her concern is that a lot of steps have been taken that haven’t involved citizen input. “The citizens need to have input on what is going on. To introduce any activities that would further encourage any commercial use would not be acceptable. We need to understand what problems we are trying to solve because I also realize that City Hall needs enlargement. We need to understand the options and then have the citizens’ vote.”

12. Britt Collins 33 Lakeshore Drive – Britt talked about the neighborly efforts to clean up the silt in the lake near 182 Lakeshore. “ Joe Voyles and Tom Peters got together in what could have been a confrontation and turned it into a win-win situation. They accomplished this by going in and getting the silt out of the lake which benefited Tom by taking out the silt that had come from his property then putting it on the lot Joe Voyles is developing because he needed the silt. A lot more silt was taken out than was actually put in. That kind of action between neighbors should be what characterizes Berkeley Lake.”

13. Cynthia Colgan 4072 South Berkeley Lake Rd. – Cynthia stated that the Chapel and the City conflict over the issue of Church and State is something that needed to be taken very seriously. “ There are three entities in this immediate area and they are: BLHA, Chapel, and the City. I suggest that representatives from all three organizations sit down and exchange ideas so that they can come up with a solution that has not been thought of so far individually. There is a big concern about public space being opened to the Boy Scouts or other organizations without having the space become open to any of the public… we are trying to limit overcrowding. I hope that it would be a last resort to take down trees in the greenspace near the City Park.” Cynthia also stated that the BLHA dues are extremely low in comparison to other homeowner’s associations and in light of that, maybe it is time for BLHA to raise the fees and then create a community building which would not be a public building for the use of our residents. “As far as the Chapel improvements, it seems like a shame to spend money improving this building without making the lake part of the environment. To think that you walk into the kitchen and you can’t even see the best part of this whole piece of property. I encourage all three of the associations to get together and come up with a common solution.”

Council Member Massaroni motioned to amend the Agenda so that added to the Working Session there is discussion of the City Center. Council Member Lombardi seconded the motion and approval was unanimous.

Council Member Massaroni explained the history of the discussions, thoughts, and ideas made by Council over the last year in regards to the proposed City Center building. : His statement was as follows: “I am Ken Massaroni and I am one of your City Council Members and have been for about three years now. We have been investigating something we call the City Center Building for about six months now because we have come to the conclusion that we have several unacceptable situations going on right now. One of the problems is that many City officials have City records in their homes and have for many years. We have other situations where citizens, through the kindness in their heart, keep City equipment in their garage or basements. Joe Voyles we are grateful to you for storing a ton of City equipment. Marcie has kept records in her home for many years. I have City records in my home. The City Manager had records in his home and with his resignation we had issues with respect to getting those records. The Mayor has records and I presume the City Finance Chairman has records in her home. The long and the short reason is that there is absolutely no space left in City Hall, as it currently exists. We have other issues, for example the crowded Court sessions, which has been mentioned already. Also, when someone comes into City Hall to ask the OEO questions about their home or get a permit they shouldn’t have to have others hear what they are saying and hear the financial details about a project to expand their home etc. etc. However, we have no office space for this kind of thing and there is no place for the OEO to go with a citizen to talk about these kinds of issues. We have no place for the City Clerk or the City Treasurer to discuss these same types of issues. The long and short of it is that we have run out of space completely. The last City Council began to investigate several options for dealing with this kind of thing. One of the things we did is that we looked around for dollars from the County and other places to try and deal with the space issue. At the time there was a Grant we had received from the County to build a pavilion and the pavilion had kind of a “dual use”; lets call it that. There would be a pavilion on top and storage space where we could keep the chain saws and winches. For a variety of reasons, the citizens were tepid on the pavilion because it would create an attractive nuisance for people outside the City to come in and use our City Park and Pavilion when we might not want to give outside folks the additional incentive to come into the City if they weren’t living here and paying taxes. So we undertook another activity, which was to investigate the possibility of expanding the existing City Hall. We had money spent to see if that could be done. We had plans developed and while up to five thousand dollars was authorized, I do not believe it cost that amount of money. We took a look at those plans and I think Joe Voyles came to one of our meetings at one time. We talked about the logistical issues we would face. The plan involved tearing down all the trees along Bush Rd. and thus exposing the City Park to more traffic. There were also a whole host of issues relating to the septic system in place at City Hall. During the course of a City Council retreat, which was open to the public, and unfortunately not nearly as well attended as tonight’s City Council meeting, we came up with a wish list of the different kinds of things that we might want in a City building. One of the first things that came up was that any building we would build would cost money. It was pointed out to us by Council Member Arakawa that if we were clever in what we call this thing, there may be County dollars available to assist us in the construction. For example, if we had just built a City Hall we would likely not have any State or County dollars through Grants we might seek. If it was called a City Center building and had the availability for City or civic functions or citizen activities, there was a much higher likelihood that State and County dollars would be available. The best example being “The Senior Citizen Center” in Grayson, which is a lovely building built on the order of the Berkeley Walk clubhouse. This center was funded entirely by County dollars. On the one hand we had burning needs from the standpoint of the City Administration and on the other hand an unwillingness to spend City dollars to the extent possible. Therefore, we started undertaking an investigation of the kinds of things we needed in terms of the administrative requirements as well as the kinds of things it would take in order to meet the City Center (the activity center) requirements. We put the wish list together and solicited the input from a couple of citizens who have experience in commercial buildings. One of the citizens is here with us tonight, Mike Penny who has been assisting us entirely on his personal time and dime at this point to help us think about the kinds of things that we might need. We have undertaken this investigation and I think I speak for the entire City Council to say that we are delighted that we have this many citizens here to look into this thing. I am a little disheartened that it took the dissemination of what I think was a lot of misinformation about this building in order to get you here. But you are here and we can move on from here. One of the best statements I heard from a couple of you is the notion that we need to have more input and perhaps a committee formed to investigate this. We would like to do that; in fact, David Steventon and I have visited the various communities and Lois or Tony met with the Chapel Association. We have been listening to the kinds of things that people perceive as the need from the standpoint of an activity center and we have been trying to explain the needs from the standpoint of administrative space. At this point we have agreed that we need about 1000 square feet of office space which will be divided up in a logical fashion that can be partitioned off so that we can have storage as well as private meetings between citizens and City officials and we can have space for the court when the judge comes to town. The way that Mike has helped us think about this in the context of the space we have in the property over here is that it would be conceivable to have a low building very much in keeping with other low buildings in the area in which the City offices would be on the top floor and then built in the basement underneath would be a large open space like this. As we contemplate it right now, this would be an unfinished space where we could store things like the chain saws and the winches or we could have an open meeting like this or yes we could use it for a function like yoga or something like that. I am here to tell you that at this point you are hearing the nature of the thoughts and discussions at the same time that the City Council is hearing for the very first time. We have not progressed anywhere near the level that some folks think we have with respect to this idea. I have heard the number of three or four hundred thousand dollars for the cost to construct this building…there is not a shred of truth in that number because we have not talked about a number. Mike has never given me a single dollar amount on this. The idea here is to figure out what we need and once we do that someone will tell us what the dollars are and if we can’t afford it then we can’t afford it and we will revise our needs. We want the needs to drive what this looks like and then worry about the dollars. If the dollars are too much that is fine. We are now trying to go through the process of understanding what the City’s needs are from the administrative standpoint and from an activity standpoint. We are very early in the process, but what I can tell you is that just in the last week and a half, Mike has come up with some plans. Basically the plans give us an idea of what an elevation would look like staying consistent with the other buildings in the area. The drawings also give us an idea of what about 1000 feet of office space would look like and how big a couple of offices would be and where the wall would be and making sure that the bathrooms would conform with all the relevant State laws. I have no idea how much this will cost. I could estimate that new construction would cost about $100 a square foot and so the estimate would be that we would have a one hundred thousand dollar building. We have no number at this point in time. Someone asked the question about the Chapel. We have a great space here. I agree it is a great space. A great space for the kind of thing we are doing right now and a great space for community activities. If we could have this available for community activities all the time, I think that would be dynamite…the problem is that it doesn’t address the administrative issues that we have right now. We wouldn’t have the storage space for City records or any office space. Can we turn the Chapel into a series of offices? I think the folks from the Chapel might not be too happy about that. If we could find a happy balance between the two it would be great. I think Joe talked about issues with respect with the Chapel being a City building and having access to the lake. We have talked about those issues also and we are trying to avoid that problem. Believe me, we are so happy that you citizens are here expressing concern about this and we are happy to hear that based on the citizens’ comments so far we have thought of all the same issues that you have presented to us tonight. Feel free to come to these meetings and tell us your thoughts and ideas. On another occasion I have also heard comments that we (Council) are doing this behind your back. I would like to point out to everyone here that we took this investigation on either late last year or very early this year and this has been on the Agenda at each and every single City Council meeting and it has been in the Working Session at least four times. We are not trying to hide anything here…we want participation…we have gone out to the homeowners’ associations to ask for participation. You now know every bit as much as the City Council knows at this point. This is very much an investigation to see what it is we need and what it is we can do, and if we can’t do anything then we will go back to the drawing board. We know we have needs and we want to explore the best way to go forward. We are serious about the need to deal with the problem and we are equally serious about having input from the citizens. We are serious about trying to do this the right way.”

Council Member Reynolds reminded the citizens that all Council telephone numbers are in the City Directory and citizens are welcome to call their elected officials at any time. Council Member Massaroni also suggested that citizens might prefer e-mail.

The Mayor urged the citizens to look at the website and make their concerns known.

Council Member Massaroni stated that in regards to the money spent so far that the City has spent money for a survey of the City Park property and that solved a couple of different issues. It gave us a basis for understanding what we could build and where we could build it and it took care of many other questions asked about the property in the past.

Mayor Salter added that in regards to concerns for commercial activities, she had asked Council to investigate community activities such as Boy Scout troop meetings, book clubs, and other activities within our City. She stated that she felt that we need a place of our own beyond that of Pinckneyville Park. There are activities that we would like to keep within our City in order to have our kids be able to ride their bike or walk to without getting across PIB. She further stated that she feels we need a community activity center somewhere within our City. She stated that she requested of the Chapel committee both in writing and in person to consider the possibility of deeding this property to the City. The City would then take over the reconstruction costs and maintenance, which would help the Chapel. Then the Chapel could be used for some of these community activities. The Chapel Board is not comfortable with the idea even though the proposal insured the Chapel Board that they could continue to use the building at no cost. The Chapel Board responded with a proposal to the City that the City would be allowed to use the Chapel for community activities if the City would fund a complete renovation of the kitchen to get it up to commercial grade. By the Chapel’s estimate, this would cost the City upwards of fifty thousand dollars. Council felt uncomfortable and borderline illegal with the idea of spending fifty thousand dollars or more on a privately owned building.

The Mayor started a sign-up sheet for citizens to sign if they are interested in becoming part of the committee to study the possible City Center. Council Member Massaroni reminded the citizens that this committee should not just entail BLHA and Chapel people but because this is a City issue, we should involve citizens from all parts of the City including Berkeley Walk, River Mansions, Berkeley Commons and Miramont.

WORKING SESSION

The Mayor suggested that Council Member Lombardi postpone discussion of the Expense Reimbursement Policy until the next Council meeting.

MINUTES

Council Member Reynolds motioned to approve the July 18th Minutes. Council Member Steventon seconded the motion. Council Member Massaroni abstained.

Mayor Salter suggested amending the Minutes under Working Session, Construction Permits and Contractor Responsibility to state, “no decision was made by Council and Council Member Steventon would investigate.

Council Member Reynolds motioned to approve the Minutes of the July 18th meeting as amended. Council Member Steventon seconded the motion. Approval was unanimous.

FINANCIAL REPORT

Council Member Massaroni moved to accept the Financial Report as filed. Council Member Lombardi seconded the motion and approval was unanimous.

STAFF AND COMMITTEE REPORTS

Mayor Salter announced that she has received the following reports: BLEMA, Arbitration Board, Finance Affairs, Stormwater Management, Communications, OEO.

ANNOUNCEMENTS AND APPOINTMENTS

Mayor Salter presented the Lois’ Laurels award to Ron and Cindy Phelps. They have lived in the community since July of 1991 and they have worked hard for our community ever since. They have spread lime in the lake, served breakfast in the Chapel, brewed good things, cooked and cleaned on the 4th of July and Earth Day. They have served on the BLHA Board and been neighborly in every way possible. Cindy works as a cross walk guard for Berkeley Lake Elementary and also monitors the beach and picnic grounds activity. They are special people and we thank them.

Mayor Salter reported on the following topics:

Dangerous curve at 50 Lakeshore- The Mayor stated that she has asked for $500 worth of boulders be placed along the curb at 50 Lakeshore to keep people from veering off the edge of the road there. She asked citizens to notify the City if there were other particular spots that could use the same treatment.

Meeting with John Linder for a new Zip Code for Berkeley Lake-On August 7th the Mayor met with John Linder in order to get a Zip Code for the City. He has promised to do that if he gets elected. The Mayor further stated that she had suggested to him that the Parsons property across PIB would make a great Post Office Branch for this area. There seems to be approval from the owner of the property and our own Planning and Zoning Commission. There is a copy of her letter to Mr. Linder on the website.

The Mayor announced that the September Gwinnett Municipal Assoc. meeting would be held at Berkeley Lake on September 10th. This is an opportunity to invite the entire County to see our beautiful community.

Berkeley Lake Vision 2003-The Mayor recognized the citizens who had created this document during the 1990’s and stated that this Vision remains active today.

The Mayor stated that there have been many citizens to complain about the noisy Fireworks that are being shot off very late in the evening and there are sick and elderly people who are being disturbed by this. There is a noise ordinance that states there should be no noise after 10 PM. Please pass the word to whoever may be doing this.

The Atlanta Regional Commission is required to notify the City of potential large developments to be constructed near the City. The latest notification is The Villages of Warsaw, which is a large development near the Pikes Garden Center on State Bridge and Hwy. 141. This will be a multi use development. The information will be in City Hall for citizens’ review.

The Mayor stated that she hoped everyone has gotten her letter in regards to the “Calling Post” system. She further stated that she would be asking for the Council’s approval for her to use the Calling Post system when there is any type of emergency in the City. Council Member Massaroni asked the Mayor to obtain input from the citizens as to how they would like the system to work. Would citizens prefer only to be called when there is an immediate emergency or would they also like to be called for other important announcements like the variance hearing on the Pete Maltese property. This question is asked because we don’t want Calling Post to become a bother to the citizens. It cost the City about 30 dollars to call everyone in town one time.

Cynthia Colgan stated that she feels the decision should be left up to the Mayor.

Jeff Pahl stated that he feels the system should be used only for emergencies…other issues like meetings that are known about in advance should be handled in other ways such as a citywide e-mail list. We should limit the calls to time-sensitive issues.

The Mayor appointed Jackie Wall to the Communications committee. The Mayor then appointed Marcie Zielazienski and Pam Williamson to serve on the Financial Affairs committee.

Council Member Massaroni motioned to approve the Mayor’s appointment of Jackie Wall to the Communications committee. Council Member Lombardi seconded the motion and approval was unanimous.

Council Member Massaroni motioned to approve the Mayor’s appointments of Marcie Zielazienski and Pam Williamson to the Financial Affairs Committee. Council Member Lombardi seconded the motion and approval was unanimous.

Council Member Massaroni stated that if there were any questions for Mr. Mike Penny about the City Center drawings they should be asked at this time. “At this point the important thing is to have office space upstairs and an open space downstairs for meetings etc. We have not yet contemplated that this open area would be used for other outside groups or activities. People don’t come and use our City Hall building for anything other than City related functions. We want to be quite careful about this issue. Because of the property’s logistics we would automatically have an open space in the downstairs of the building. We have not contemplated kitchen or bathroom facilities for downstairs. At this point it would be considered somewhat like a garage.”

George Sipe stated that he realizes that the uses have not been worked out at this time. “But the question boils down to if we allow one single tax paying Boy Scout troop to use this facility then we are obligated to allow anyone else to use it…the only thing we may be able to do is charge some different fees. For example, we might be able to charge the tax paying Boy Scout troop a dollar per usage and other outside groups would have to pay some higher fee. This higher fee must be within certain limits. The point is we cannot stop outside groups from using the building if we allow any non-governmental use of the building. We would be safe as long as we did not allow anyone to use it except for meetings such as this and so on… It is important to make this clear to citizens as to how this building would be used. It is either a Community Center that is open or its not.”

Jackie Wall stated that the existing City Hall is in fact an historical building and it would be important for citizens to think about how it can be preserved.

Jack Andreu stated that he does not understand why we should consider building a new building when we should get together and use this building (Chapel) for all our facilities. “We don’t draw enough people to this building for us to have to build another building with tax dollars. The thought is ridiculous.”

Jeff Pahl stated that Council answered the previous question during the first hour of the meeting. He further stated that as someone who comes to these meetings almost every month, he would like to say that Ken did a good job of explaining what he has understood for months. He stated that he is glad to see other citizens finally showing up. He stated that we need to spend our tax money on a building with air conditioning. “ It is hot like this in here every month and these people sit here for three hours in it. Every month the Council discusses how much they don’t want to spend our tax dollars and they want to find a Grant or some way to pay for this building. They are not out to just spend our tax money.”

Bob Herb asked about the possible parking issues that could be created if a new building is constructed.

Mr. Penny stated that he feels that the existing parking area is adequate for a building of the size proposed. Mr. Massaroni explained that this is very early in the planning stages and he is aware that parking will be one of the issues to deal with during the planning of the building.

Dick Lackey stated that there are County-zoning regulations that govern the issue and it is his belief that as a developer, one figures about four parking places per thousand square feet of office space. He further stated that if the design offers a downstairs for storage and meetings that there is no interior stairway. He would suggest this idea be considered.

Mr. Massaroni reminded the citizens that the upstairs space would be for record storage and the downstairs would be for the outdoor equipment such as chain saws etc.

Theresa Sipe asked if the bottom floor space is being built with no intention in mind and therefore it could slip through any codes that might apply if the City named what the space would be used for? “If there were a space downstairs, wouldn’t the City be required to have a bathroom?”

Mr. Massaroni stated that first of all, we are not building anything. “We are simply talking about the needs of the City for administrative space and the certain needs the City might have for activity space. This is an intellectual exercise to decide what to do about storage for City records and storage for City equipment and so forth. The downstairs space is only there because of the need for the office space upstairs.”

Ms. Sipe read from the June 20th meeting Minutes, which stated, “to move forward with planning of the new City Center building” and then asked Mr. Massaroni what that meant in relationship to what he just said.

Mr. Massaroni stated that Council had a wish list from the standpoint of administrative space for storage and office space and also a list in terms of activity space. “What would that look like if we put pencil to paper and actually came up with a building? We solicited the help of a citizen who builds commercial space and asked him to help us understand how the building would look and give suggestions in the context of how the City looks now in order to maintain the natural look of the area. Moving ahead with the planning, we are taking a bunch of ideas that people had about the needs of the City and we are trying to put it on paper so we can see what the next step might be…how much it will cost, could we get County funds? It is impossible to just say we want to build a City Center without going through these preliminary steps to define what it would look like and where we would build and who would pay for it and so forth. These steps are immense. So to say that we are going forward with the planning is to say that we are taking the next logical step forward in the progression, which is soliciting the help of a citizen to translate our list of wishes into something to see what it would look like. If our list of wishes translates into a five thousand square foot building that will cost a million dollars, we wouldn’t be having this discussion. The next step is to say that it is a building of about one thousand square feet and this is what it might look like given that we now have a survey of the property. What would be involved in taking down trees? What kind of sewage issues are involved? There are many logical questions that need to be investigated.”

Ms. Sipe asked at what point would the citizens have input on this? Would there be a town meeting etc.?

Mr. Massaroni reminded citizens of the sign-up sheet currently being passed around in order to be called upon as part of a citizens committee to investigate the issue. He also stated that the issue has been discussed in the Council meetings and Working Sessions for at least the last six months. The suggestion has been made that this has been done behind the back of the citizens and nothing could be farther from the truth. “ If citizens are not aware, it is because citizens have not been paying attention to the Minutes, the website, or coming to the meetings. We welcome and are asking for the participation of citizens.”

Debbie Guthrie stated that she would like to know where the building would be situated on the lot? Where would the parking be etc.? “Based on the way this issue has been communicated with the citizens, I personally do not believe that there has been a concerted effort to get this information to the City.” Examples are that the “Post Office” issue was right on the front page of the website and could not be missed…another example is the letter received in the mail yesterday introducing the “Calling Post” and weather radios.” She stated that she has seen nothing along those lines about this issue. This is a concern to herself and other citizens with which she has spoken. “If you want us to sign up and support what you are doing you need to communicate with the citizens. We are aware that City Hall is obviously too small of a space. The storage of records in peoples’ homes is a valid problem, but the citizens need to know about these issues if we are going to be committing to a building like this. There has been a huge lack of communication and the City knows how to communicate. It is wrong to say that if you want to know what is going on you need to come to the Council meetings. That is one way, but is wrong to say that it is the only way.”

Mr. Massaroni stated that the parking would most likely be where parking is now and we would likely put two or three spaces on the South end of where it is now. The hope would be that we could get away with putting on just exactly the amount of spaces we would lose on the front end when the County installs the sidewalks on Bush Road. Mr. Massaroni also stated that he agrees that the City is good at communicating some things and not always good at communicating other things. He further stated that he believes that the City has been good at communicating this issue. He, Dave and Lois have gone out to homeowner’s association groups and we have met with the Chapel association. “Not everything can be communicated in the same way. We will work hard to continue communicating on this issue. We all have a right to know what is going on in the City but we do have an obligation to inform ourselves. We haven’t sent out a “Calling Post” and we haven’t done a letter, but frankly we are not at the point where we are ready to tell you anything. The drawing you see here tonight is the first drawing we have of anything that is meaningful. The question has been asked by one of the Council Members whether we should do a “Calling Post” and the answer was, “and say what?” Until a few days ago when we got the drawing, there was nothing to say other than we have a list of things we need but we don’t know anything else. Now that we have come to this point, we will work hard to see that citizens stay informed.”

Ms. Guthrie stated that she still maintains that if the City wants citizens’ approval, it would save Council a whole lot of time to proactively sell the project to them. “ There could be total buy-in if citizens understand what the problems are. There are many different ways of communication in the City and the “Post Office” communication on the website is a perfect way.” She further stated that she would like to know exactly where the building would be located on the lot.

Mr. Massaroni stated that we are not sure yet. We are still at the very preliminary stages of investigation.

Mr. Skip Johnson asked if the City has investigated renting office space off campus.

Mr. Massaroni stated that there is no office space currently within the City limits. It has been considered that the developer of the Parson’s property was to include office space within the development and there was actually a very preliminary discussion about doing something like that. Mr. Massaroni further stated that he did not feel that it would be very popular to spend City dollars to put a City Hall outside the City limits.

Cindy Phelps stated that she feels that there has been a misunderstanding about the beginning time for the meeting tonight. She also stated that the amount of people that turn out for Council meetings is enough if there could be liaisons between the groups. “The Chapel is trying to continue a wonderful tradition in this City and we were trying to give the City a great deal by offering the Chapel rental to the City for $75 a meeting. We need to stop doing that because then we could have taken those dollars and renovated the building ourselves. There has been a communication problem, but the citizens do care and they do want to help. The amount of signatures tonight is proof that the community cares.”

George Kaffezakis thanked Mr. Penny for his drawings and thanked Mr. Massaroni for doing an excellent job of explaining what is going on. “It is obvious that this is a project that is just starting and I feel informed and I thank you guys. The question is that possibly during the design process could there be consideration for cubicles and moveable partitions rather than the hard walls drawn here in this drawing.”

OLD BUSINESS

Floodplain Ordinance 2nd Read

Council Member Reynolds motioned to approve the changes in the Floodplain Ordinance. Council Member Steventon seconded the motion and approval was unanimous.

Ordinance Chapter 17- Steventon

Council Member Steventon explained his proposed changes to the Septic Tank Maintenance Ordinance. There was much discussion. Mr. Steventon will also investigate the possibility of the City certifying Septic Tank contractors.

Council Member Steventon motioned to place the changes to Ordinance Chapter 17 and the inspection form on First Read. Council Member Lombardi seconded the motion and approval was unanimous.

Construction Permits and contractor responsibility – Steventon

Council Member Steventon read the response to his question to George Sipe about contractor responsibility. After much discussion, City Attorney Carothers stated that he would look into the matter.

Ridge Road Drainage Improvements

Report forthcoming at the next Council meeting. The Mayor explained that she has spoken with the engineers and they have withdrawn their previous proposals stating that they believe that plan might cause more problems rather than help. The Mayor further stated that she has asked the engineers for estimates for the ideas and options that they do have and be prepared to answer questions about those at the next Council meeting.

Other

Council Member Massaroni motioned to create a committee of the 25 people that have signed up to help explore possibilities for the City Center building. The committee will be co-chaired by Mr. Massaroni and Council Member Steventon. Council Member Lombardi seconded the motion and approval was unanimous.

Sidewalks – The Mayor stated that she has contacted Alan Chapman who works for the County about the sidewalks as they would impact the Chapel and got information and a drawing from him which have been given to the Chapel Board. The Mayor stated that she brought the drawing for citizens’ review at tonight’s meeting. He will also be contacting Theresa Sipe and Cindy Holten from the Chapel Board in regards to this issue.

NEW BUSINESS

Resolution on Bank Signatures – Reynolds

No motion was made.

Budget 2003

The Mayor stated that one item in the budget may need to be increased and they are things having to do with street maintenance. Some of our streets particularly in the Ryland subdivisions are starting to develop problems. Clay Keller from Miramont was kind enough to generate a list for us from his area, which identifies two sinkholes as well as other issues. Other homeowners’ presidents are creating lists for the City from their individual communities. Council Member Reynolds stated that the City should have a yearly contract with one company so that we don’t have to bid on or deal with a lot of little problems. There were many other questions asked by Council Members. Council Member Reynolds stated that there was a proposed meeting of the Financial Affairs Committee at 7:00PM at City Hall on August 24th. She will confirm and post on website and the City Hall marquee.

Expense Reimbursement Policy – Lombardi

The discussion of the Reimbursement Policy was postponed until the next Council meeting.

CITIZEN COMMENTS

The following citizens made Citizen Comments:

Bob Herb 17 Lakeshore Drive – Bob stated that in regards to the parking issue for the City Center wouldn’t it be prudent to make some calls to be certain of the cost for construction of enough parking area and what the County codes and regulations are and would all that information blow the whole scheme out of the water before there is any more work on the project.

Tom Peters 111 Little Ridge Road – Tom asked when the City plans to fix the drainage problem at his home. The City has known about these issues for at least four years. Bob Flaherty visited the issue on a number of occasions and a number of contractors have also looked at the problem. The City has not acted on the problem, which has been a problem at least as long ago as the tornado. He asked how he as a citizen could get some action taken to correct this problem with the City’s infrastructure.

The Mayor stated that she would follow up with Mr. Peters very soon to understand his issues.

Cynthia Colgan 4027 South Berkeley Lake Road – Cynthia stated that she if familiar with some of the issues in regards to septic systems and would like to offer her input before the revised septic ordinance passes. “ There are multiple systems on some properties and there have been inspections that have passed with only one of the systems being inspected. In respect to the fact that there are some existing failed systems still in the City, is there a way to put a mechanics lean on the property so that ownership cannot be transferred until the septic system is repaired or replaced. As far as certifying inspectors, it is very important that the inspector is required to get down into the tank because of the T valve, which is a mandatory operative part of the system, and if it fails then the field fails. Without looking at that part which there is no way to do without getting into the tank, we do not know the condition of the field at all.”

The Mayor responded by stating that while the City’s Septic Ordinance is on the cutting edge for septic maintenance, we learned many things while enforcing it. We found issues like you point out that were not covered in the original ordinance and that is why we are making changes. When we say we have 100% compliance we mean that they have complied to the ordinance as it is written now. We will make note of your suggestions as we make the changes in the ordinance. Council Member Steventon addressed the fact that multiple systems are covered in the present ordinance. The inspectors are required to pull from the Health Dept. the County records on the system for the house. This is to show the plat where the system is located and where the drain field is located. If there are multiple systems they should show up on the plat.

Cindy Phelps 4331 S Berkeley Lake Rd – Cindy asked if she could get a regular update on the sewer line coming into Berkeley Lake. “ Where will it be installed first and what is the time line for the installment…this is an important issue to keep citizens updated about so we can be involved in the requirements for attaching to the line.”

Tom Kitchens reported that the County has proposed giving some cities money to help get them off of septic systems and have sewer put into their area. Mr. Kitchens stated that he, along with his neighbor Gary Moore, decided to compete for this money by using a section of the City that is all gravity fed, in this case from Bush Rd. down to Mr. Hegner’s property. This includes nineteen houses. We had to have 70% or more of the residents to sign up for the service. The County would pay for half the expense and the homeowner would be responsible for the other half, which would be roughly five thousand dollars, financed over 30 years at 6%. The plumbing fee to get a pipe from the home to the sewer line would cost about $1370. The proposal is still in front of the County Commissioners for approval. If approved, we might get that section of the City done sometime in 2003. Since that time we have been asked to consider a line going up as far as where the City Center would be and include the Chapel area. Our contact at the County says he can do it verbally but there is no price yet and that is where we stand at this point.

George Sipe 401 Lakeshore Drive – George suggested that Council could ease citizens’ minds about the progression towards a City Center by passing a Resolution that this Council will not enter into spending money to construct a new City Center without a Referendum. “ If the citizens know that you are not going to do this at some meeting they are not attending, but will have the Public Hearings that are necessary, they will be at ease. This will satisfy a lot of concerns. This is the most expensive thing we have purchased in the City since the Greenspace was purchased.”

Betty Covington 342 Lakeshore – Betty questioned whether the sign up sheet was for citizens to look at the design of the City Center itself or if it was for citizens to look at the problem itself and offer various solutions.

Mr. Massaroni stated that we are perfectly happy to look at everything from the beginning. If there are better solutions to the City’s current problems of administrative and storage space then we want to explore them.

Britt Collins 33 Lakeshore Drive – Britt asked if some of the surveys for public opinion that Council has sought and were mentioned tonight weren’t negative reactions, but Council was going to proceed anyway. Britt asked about a Grant for a building and what was that amount.

Mr. Massaroni explained that the Grant was for a Pavilion to be built in the City Park and not for City Hall. There was a need for storage so we thought that some of the City’s equipment could be stored underneath the Pavilion. That has been the only Grant the City has received. The Mayor stated that the Grant included a small extension to the back of City Hall that could be used as extra office space. Council Member Lombardi stated that if he remembered correctly the City was looking at 70 or 80 thousand dollars to do that of which the maximum amount of the Grant was 25 thousand. So we were looking at 50 thousand to end up with a family pavilion and some storage space. At the time it did not seem like a wise solution to the problem. The Mayor stated that the figure Mr. Lombardi was talking about was when Council began to discuss the enclosure of the pavilion to include heat and air conditioning. That was just one option considered.

Britt stated that the concern is that negative input was given concerning the Civic Center and Council was not responding to that input. Council felt that they knew best and a lot of people were not showing up to these meetings and if they are not interested it doesn’t matter anyway. Is that wrong information?

Mr. Massaroni stated that the concept of a social center was not one that was well received for some of the same reasons we have heard tonight. At the same time, the answer for City administrative space is a different issue and has been well received. As previously stated for reasons mentioned we walk a fine line in what we call the building and how we use it. Council Member Steventon added that the negative response came primarily from those who had social facilities.

Cindy Phelps stated that Pinkneyville is available and has been discussed at previous meetings. “Once again, this building that we are in tonight, has been rented to the City at $75 a meeting and it would have been rented to citizens for $200 a meeting. We are way under budget from the Chapel point of view. With more rent money we could have a better place for the City to meet.”

Jackie Wall 515 Lakeshore- Jackie asked about extra funding for the Fall Festival. She asked if it was too late at this time to ask for more funding for the 2002 festival or should she be asking now for the 2003 festival. “ The other comment is to say that there are a lot of people who live in Miramont who seem to use Ridge Rd for access to their property. How much is that helping the drainage problems along there? Why should they be able to access their property with construction vehicles through the rear of the property?”

The Mayor agreed that the Ordinance Officer has had to go after people who have moved fences and destroyed the buffer area. There was discussion about the rise in costs for the Fall Festival. Council Member Steventon suggested that because of the possible plumbing problems during the 4th of July celebration, there might be a need for extra funding for portable toilets. Mr. Steventon also suggested the committee put together a budget so that we could look at a number.

BJ Barrett 13 Lakeshore – BJ stated her support for a new City Center. She stated that when she goes in City Hall for information or have a meeting she can not hear herself think because if there is another conversation going on, the place is so small with no separate rooms that she can not conduct her business. For that reason and more she is in favor of building a City Center for the administrative, storage, staffing and business of the City. She also stated that to have any kind of municipal building within the Chapel would endanger the private area around the lake. She stated that she would like to see the building separate and across the street from the Chapel for security reasons.

Bob Herb 17 Lakeshore Drive – Bob stated that the Chapel Board is willing to work with the City to try and work out the problems. If storage space is a problem the board could consider building or leasing just storage space. When it comes to community events we have already indicated that we are open to any type of event that the City has asked for and we would like to go on public record by saying that our Chapel Board is willing to try and work with the City to provide these facilities. We have a community that is a little different from other communities and the Chapel Board is more than willing to work with the City to accomplish the goals set forth tonight.

Jeff Pahl asked if the sidewalk drawing would be available at City Hall for citizen’s review.

The Mayor answered in the affirmative.

THERE BEING NO FURTHER NEW BUSINESS, COUNCIL MEMBER MASSARONI MOTIONED TO ADJOURN INTO EXECUTIVE SESSION IN ORDER TO DISCUSS LEGAL ISSUES. COUNCIL MEMBER LOMBARDI SECONDED THE MOTION. THE COUNCIL MEETING WAS ADJOURNED AT 9:10 PM.

AFTER EXECUTIVE SESSION THERE WERE NO CITIZENS PRESENT. THERE BEING NO FURTHER NEW BUSINESS COUNCIL MEMBER REYNOLDS MOVED AND COUNCIL MEMBER STEVENTON SECONDED TO ADJOURN THE MEETING. APPROVAL WAS UNANIMOUS.

Respectfully Submitted,

Claire Grimes